When interacting with fandom, shipping is one of the most popular thing you will see in it. Whether you're on a blogging platform, social media or archive of our own (ao3 for short), you will notice that things that are shown the most are romantic ships. Now, certain fandoms may look different and have less of it, but it is still a staple in many communities.

There is still a specific set of discourse that comes with this though, and I'm not talking about outsiders complaining about ships existing, but rather the infighting that a specific group of people loves to stir up every few months. For purpouses of this, I will be sticking with ao3 as the main conversation as trying to do this with art isn't as easy due to not having a proper way to count it like we do for fanfiction. This is also about a very specific loud minority that I am aware is not a representative of the entire community, but with how loud they can get, it makes it easy to assume most are the same way or at least are as mean as them.

Before we do start, a couple of words and their meanings so that the text is easier to understand:
Fujoshi - a woman who likes bl
Fudanshi - a man who likes bl
Himejoshi - woman who likes gl
Himedanshi - man who likes gl

These terms are usually used when talking about original works and their fans of them, but they often used within online fandom too, even of the source media is not romance.

Other terms sometimes used:
m/m - ship between two men
f/f - ship between two women
m/f or f/m - ship between

Another important thing: this is strictly talking about fanfiction and fan works of already existing media: original fiction or original characters of smaller creators that happen to post on ao3 is not included in this conversation. There is only one situation where actual creators of some media will be mentioned.

So, what's the deal?

A very specific group of himejoshis (that I will sometimes call them “twitter himejoshis” for easier understanding, but this is not exclusive to twitter itself, it can be found in other places too) are constantly “at war” with fujoshis. Quotations here, because this is a one-sided thing.

In general, fandom spaces hold more m/m ships over f/f ones, for more than one reason. It can be because media has more male over female characters, female characters are not as well written as male ones, most female characters are simply not as present as male ones. Or people just simply like male characters more than female ones. Reasons are all personal and are simply a preference in what fan works the person likes to write and read.

This can, understandably, cause anyone who prefers f/f ships to be a bit disappointed when they don't see many works in their tags compared to what m/m and m/f ships have. Wanting more of something you like and wishing more people to like the same thing is not a bad reaction, and wanting to spread it to others in hopes that they will enjoy it too is a great idea. Supporting already existing works and showing it to others is another great way to do this.

However, these himejoshis don't do any of that. Instead, they make bait posts on the internet and harass anyone who doesn't agree with them, even other himejoshis and real-life lesbians who create stuff they enjoy.

Annual complains

Like clockwork, every two to three months, you will see people complain about the lack of f/f “content” on ao3.

In general, referring to anything created in the fandom sphere for free as “content” irks a lot of people, myself included. Fan fiction is made for free (unless you outright commission a writer), it is a labour of love, expecting a writer to chunk out works for your enjoyment is a quite mean thing. This in of itself can be explained by current online situation almost everywhere, so to a degree, it can be forgiven on the grand scale though reminding people that you shouldn't call fan works content is something worth pointing out.

That is, if this is where it ended, but it does not.

These tweets are followed by himejoshis harassing fujoshis for daring to write for their ships instead of writing f/f ships which… does not make sense? If someone's primary ship is a m/m one, they are going to write that one more than anything else. They are less likely to write other things if they have an OTP that they're ride or die for. Most people tend to have 2-3 ships they love a lot and write for the most, everything else will be an afterthought. And once again, this is made for free because they like it.

Most of the time, f/f writers also write what they love the most. It is true that there is less of them, but they do exist and also create works that come from the same place as the m/m ones. What does seem to be the problem is that the sheer number of f/f writers is lower than the m/m ones, so numbers will realistically be different, scewing to one side over the other.

Frustration over this? It's valid. Harassment is not.

Going out of the way to say “I hope yaoislop writers get stoned” is not how you get people to enjoy your f/f ship more, it does the opposite thing.

Every time something like this happens, there's a bingo going around of things these himejoshis say that almost always gets fielld fully, and it's usually insults and misogynistic remarks aimed at (usually) other women for daring to like m/m more than f/f.

Harassing queer women over fictional characters is cool, apparently

I mentioned at the beginning that I will use one example of people being assholes to a creator of media to showcase how vile and mean some of these himejoshis can get. This is the time I mention it.

Alien Stage is an animated project let by VIVINOS in collaboration with Qmeng. They are both lesbians and are openly dating. The series has both a m/m and f/f couple, of which the f/f one (Mizi and Sua) are the main focus.

In September of 2024, Qmeng removed all of her Instagram posts, resulting in a commotion in the community. Afterwards, a wave of harassment came, saying Qmeng “ruined” VIVINOS' creation by including bl in it. More in the screenshots below (click images to enlarge them).

Mind you, these people claim to be “yuri lovers”, yet go out of their way to harass a woman who is an out lesbian, for daring to have an input on something her girlfriend is working on while also being on the project too. VIVINOS didn't even hate it, mind you, if she had an issue with it, it would not have been out into the show.

Beyond just that, watering her down to VIVINOS' “fujo girlfriend” who will “just leave her for a man” and outright insulting her, just showcases how little respect they have for a woman who makes what they like.

This is the one example of people harassing a creator, one that blew up, but this happens all the time on the fandom level between people for multiple reasons.

The main thing I will mention here is also daring to also like m/m ships and writing or drawing them too. These himejoshis will throw a tantrum if you create for something that isn't f/f. You either only like that or you're a traitor.

I will quote something an aqueitence of mine has posted, but leave it anonymous for privacy.

“I like yuri/GL but god are certain fans from a certain place annoying... Calling a woman whose opinions you dislike (I am kinda iffy about the posts and translations too btw) sexist slurs is so weird... Are you better than her? Are you sure you are not the one being a misogynist?”

This was also followed by:

“Making GL content in [fandom name] is hard but at least the people I am surrounded with don't go around calling stuff yaoislop or hetslop, and won't call me cocksucker/male-centered when I draw other stuff”

Without going too deep into fandom itself, the person in question likes mostly f/f ships, with maybe two to three m/m ones. We both know the same people, so I know why they say this. Our friends are nice and we've never had a problem like this, but step out of this small circle, this is not the case. You like one m/m ship? Traitor, you're male centered, you hate women! This is how these people operate, they can't stand their ships not being the most popular ones and the only ones talked about.

Actually doing anything to make things better? No, that's not an option either

Remember the bingo thing I mentioned? While I don't have a proper example of one on hand, there is always one thing that's on there every time these arguments come up regarding fan fiction, no matter what:

Write it yourself.

This is a very simple thing. Something you like doesn't have fan fiction? You're gonna have to do it yourself! This is a situation I'm all too familiar with it, as one time the ship I was interested in had one single fic. Now, years later, while I'm not interested in the ship in question anymore, the ship tag sits at around 70 fics, of which I did at least 50 with both of the accounts I used at the time (now all orphaned). For 3 years, I sat down and wrote things cause I liked them that much.

I've recently had a similar situation, specifically with a f/f ship, though as it's not my main interest I write it less than my OTPs. One fic originally (that was them being a side ship), now there's 4 with some unpublished still being worked on. Considering I will not be leaving this fandom anytime soon, there's so much space for cool stuff to come from me, and maybe even someone else.

Sadly, creation does not seem to be something these people care about. In fact, the moment it's mentioned people get defensive and say “you missed the point”. Which, in my honest opinion, is not the case at all. Sad about lack of something? Make it yourself! There's an obvious trend of himejoshis who complain about this not putting the effort in fostering a nice community at all. That's not how you get what you want.

There's something I noticed with them going in and saying “why wouldn't people support what already exists” and that's a good point! Why aren't you doing that? Because more often than not, they are not even engaging with the fan works they claim to like. You will go into their ao3 account, and besides not seeing anything in the works section, if you go to bookmarks, you will also see nothing, or even funnier, very little f/f fics and a lot of m/m fics. Talk about hypocrisy.

Conclusion: this online group of himejoshis are assholes

As I said before, this is a minority group, but as they are quite loud, it's something you will sadly see more than the ones who spread a beautiful community and love for the ships they enjoy. It's not unknown that communities get bad reputations due to a small loud groups of people, regardless of what the rest of it is like. I've met some really nice himejoshis who do their thing and encourage others to write or draw in a way that does make positive changes and fosters a nice community! I do wish there was more of people like that, as it truly isn't enough, especially these days.

The thing I can say about this specific group of asshole himejoshis is: stay away from them. Avoid any argument engagement that is outright made with intent to be hostile to others, especially fujoshis and fudanshis, engagement farming or their intent is not to make things better by making a positive change. You will save yourself a lot of time.

What to do to make things better?

To not end this writing on a negative note, I decided to show some links, mainly communities, where you can share and create works and where it's encouraged via creative events and exchanges. I will note these are all adult only, as Dreamdiwth as a site is mainly occupied by adults, at lest on the fandom side.

Other ways of making fandom spaces better when it comes to f/f works is being nice, leaving comments on people's works, speaking positively of the things that are already available, just overall being a nice person. Don't be a dick and you're already doing quite a lot.